SIGRIST:

This is Paul Sigrist for the National Park Service. Today is Sunday, June 27, 1993. I'm at the home of Anne Povilaitis, P-O-V-I-L-A-I-T-I-S in Bristol, Connecticut. It is about three in the afternoon, and Anne is with us, and we're going to interview Anne's mother, Justina Brozinskas. Mrs. Brozinskas came from Lithuania in 1912 when she was sixteen years old. Anyway, good afternoon. Can you we start, Mrs. Brozinskas, by you telling me your birth date? When were you born?

BROZINSKAS:

Birth date? January . . .

SIGRIST:

Anne, you may speak if you wish.

BROZINSKAS:

'97, '99. January '99.

POVILAITIS:

No, no, no, Ma. March.

BROZINSKAS:

I mean March. That's right. You're right. March 19 . . .

POVILAITIS:

Twenty-nine.

SIGRIST:

March 29th.

POVILAITIS:

1895.

SIGRIST:

1895 is when you were born, correct? You were born in 1895? Yes?

POVILAITIS:

Yes, Ma. She won't hear you.

SIGRIST:

Okay. That's okay. Go right ahead.

BROZINSKAS:

( to her daughter ) You come up here. You tell me, because I don't know a lot of things.

POVILAITIS:

You were born March 29th, 1895.

BROZINSKAS:

Uh-huh.

POVILAITIS:

Okay?

BROZINSKAS:

Okay.

SIGRIST:

What was your maiden name? What was your name before you were married?

BROZINSKAS:

Marculaitis.

SIGRIST:

Can you spell that?

BROZINSKAS:

Oh, Marculaitis. She could spell it.

SIGRIST:

Anne, could you, for the recording, spell it for us.

POVILAITIS:

M-A-R . . .

BROZINSKAS:

Marculaitis.

POVILAITIS:

M-A-R-C, M-A-R-C-U-L-A-I-T-I-S.

BROZINSKAS:

Marculaitis.

SIGRIST:

Marculaitis. That was your maiden name . . .

BROZINSKAS:

Yes.

SIGRIST:

Before you were married. Where in Lithuania were you born?

BROZINSKAS:

What, in Lithuania?

SIGRIST:

Where in Lithuania? What town?

BROZINSKAS:

What town? Punia, Punia. Punia was the town, Punia.

SIGRIST:

Is that near a larger city? Is there a larger city near that town?

BROZINSKAS:

Near the city? Where the town is? Gee, I forgot. I know, just now I get mixed up.

SIGRIST:

That's okay. It will come back to you. Can you describe the town, what it looked like when you were a little girl growing up in Lithuania? What did the town look like?

BROZINSKAS:

Town? Well, it was fifty, fifty horse, like Lithuanian call it, people, (?) fifty homes.

SIGRIST:

Homes, fifty families.

BROZINSKAS:

Fifty homes in Lithuania it was. After separated and farmer break the town, and go on the farm. I live one year on the farm, and I come in this country after.

SIGRIST:

Whose farm did you live on?

BROZINSKAS:

Huh?

SIGRIST:

Whose farm was it that you lived on?

BROZINSKAS:

( to her daughter ) What does that mean?

POVILAITIS:

Whose farm did you live on? Whose farm? Your father's? Whose farm? Was it your father's farm?

BROZINSKAS:

Father's farmer.

POVILAITIS:

Yeah. Who owned the farm? Your father?

BROZINSKAS:

Huh?

POVILAITIS:

Who owned the farm? Did your father own the farm?

BROZINSKAS:

Yeah, yeah.

POVILAITIS:

And what did you raise on the farm?

BROZINSKAS:

Raise? Uh, it wasn't that big farm. Just raise, you know, vegetables a little bit, rye a little bit, that barley, raise a little by little, because not too big farm it was. Just raise those things. And I have one cow.

SIGRIST:

Was the cow for milk?

BROZINSKAS:

Milk.

SIGRIST:

Did you milk the cow?

BROZINSKAS:

Yes, yes.

SIGRIST:

Did the cow have a name?

BROZINSKAS:

The cow's name? Just cow, that's all. ( they laugh ) That's all, cow. It was a brown color.

SIGRIST:

Did you have to milk the cow?

BROZINSKAS:

Oh, yes.

SIGRIST:

Did you milk the cow?

BROZINSKAS:

Oh, yes.

SIGRIST:

How do you milk a cow? Tell us how you milk a cow?

BROZINSKAS:

I milk a cow with a pail. That's all.

POVILAITIS:

With your hands.

BROZINSKAS:

With hands, with hands. Oh, yes, with hands. With hands milk the cow.

SIGRIST:

Did you have any other animals?

BROZINSKAS:

No. But it was in city used to have sheep, used to have a lot of pigs. Just on the farm no have much, because not too much land, this, don't have too much. This is just have one cow, one horse. And I think a couple of chickens, a few chickens.

SIGRIST:

Can you describe what the house looked like on the farm?

BROZINSKAS:

The house?

SIGRIST:

The house.

BROZINSKAS:

Not too big, not too big house. Just I can't explain there how big now. Not too big.

SIGRIST:

How many rooms?

BROZINSKAS:

Rooms? Oh, you know, not have many a room, three rooms was, kitchen and have, you know, another room you just keep vegetables. The room, the second room, this is, when they walk in they have, like, I think they have to keep there, you know, in that room. Like . . .

SIGRIST:

Like a storeroom, a room where you stored food.

BROZINSKAS:

Storeroom, this keep vegetables, even in that third room. Well, they take eat, for eat and other things.

SIGRIST:

How did you heat the house?

BROZINSKAS:

How did you heat?

SIGRIST:

How did you heat the house? How did you keep it warm?

BROZINSKAS:

Well, have a stove, a stove, you know. In the morning, you know, with the wood, cooking, and the house get warm all day and all night. Nighttime again a little bit make fire.

SIGRIST:

Is it cold in Lithuania?

BROZINSKAS:

Summertime nice, very nice and hot. Just in wintertime it's cold. Yes, in wintertime it gets cold, a lot of snow have.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember when you were a little girl a blizzard or a big snowstorm that sticks out in your mind?

BROZINSKAS:

Oh, yes. It was a big storm, a big snow. One time I remember it was so much snow. My, I forgot who was, my father or a brother, I don't know, they shovelled, this was on the side, snow, (?)

SIGRIST:

All the way up on the house.

BROZINSKAS:

Yeah. Yeah, on the, from the house in the road. From the yard. This is a lot of snow was. This, I forgot which one shovelled, this was very high. Sometimes no have much. Sometimes we have a lot.

SIGRIST:

How did people travel in the snow?

BROZINSKAS:

Well, they shovel the road.

SIGRIST:

Did you have a sleigh to travel in?

BROZINSKAS:

No, shovel with the shoveling. They have some guy there, some guy, you know . . .

POVILAITIS:

Did he have a sled?

BROZINSKAS:

A sled, you know, some guy, he go with that on the side, push it on the sides.

SIGRIST:

When you were a little girl did you like to play in the snow?

BROZINSKAS:

Uh, I used to go, I used to walk. I used to go to school, you know. You know, come back to the snow.

SIGRIST:

What was your house made out of?

BROZINSKAS:

What does that mean?

POVILAITIS:

Your house, was it wood or what kind? Wood, your house? Was it wood?

BROZINSKAS:

Wood, wood. Oh, yeah, wood.

SIGRIST:

Your house was made out of wood.

BROZINSKAS:

Wood, yes. And the roof, this is straw, straw roof.

SIGRIST:

Straw roof.

BROZINSKAS:

Yes, straw roof, yes. The whole house wood. Inside this we have, a little bit plaster inside.

SIGRIST:

Did you have any windows in your house?

BROZINSKAS:

Oh yes, yes. We have two in the kitchen, yes. Two in the kitchen, no, four in the kitchen, four. One, two, three four. Four in the kitchen. Four kitchen windows.

SIGRIST:

What did the kitchen look like? Could you describe the kitchen for me?

BROZINSKAS:

The kitchen, you know, same size this way and the other way. ( she gestures ) Not round, just like square.

SIGRIST:

Square.

POVILAITIS:

Did you have a table and chairs in the kitchen?

BROZINSKAS:

Yeah, we have table, and not the chairs . . .

POVILAITIS:

A bench?

BROZINSKAS:

Benches. One, two, three. Three benches. Two long ones and one short one, three benches.

SIGRIST:

Did you have any cupboards in the kitchen, cupboards?

BROZINSKAS:

Cupboards?

SIGRIST:

Cupboards in the kitchen?

BROZINSKAS:

Cupboards? Yes, for dishes. We have cupboards for the dishes. And they have other things they have for spoons, put. ( she gestures )

SIGRIST:

Like a rack for the spoons. Like a spoon rack. You hung your spoons up.

BROZINSKAS:

Yes, hang your spoons on that thing, one, two, three, four, like that. You know, (?).

SIGRIST:

Did you have a pump, a water pump in the house? Water pump?

POVILAITIS:

What did you, where was your water? Did you have a water sink? Did you have a sink in the kitchen?

BROZINSKAS:

No, no, no. Outside water, well. Bring with the pail in the house, we have some cups with paper and pail, use it.

SIGRIST:

Did the well freeze in the winter?

BROZINSKAS:

No. No, no, no, no, no, no. Deep, digging deep and building up with the wood, that well.

SIGRIST:

Where did you sleep in your house?

BROZINSKAS:

Sleep?

SIGRIST:

Where did you sleep in your house?

BROZINSKAS:

Well, we have one, two, two beds in back of the stove, in back of build the stove. In back of the stove have, like, couch, to sleep one person there. And you two and two sleep on the beds.

SIGRIST:

Who lived in this house? Who was your family? Who is in your family at this time?

BROZINSKAS:

How many in family? Well, what I, just father and mother and I have another brother, a brother. Yes. And five people, five people in family, I guess.

SIGRIST:

What was your father's name?

BROZINSKAS:

Johnny.

SIGRIST:

And what did he do for a living in Lithuania?

BROZINSKAS:

For a living? Well, when in city was different. Just now, what they get, plant on the farm where they, near home, if something grow this is, make living from that.

SIGRIST:

He sold his vegetables?

BROZINSKAS:

Vegetables, yes. Vegetables, and if he have rice, barley, using that.

POVILAITIS:

Your father used to do a lot of fishing.

BROZINSKAS:

Oh, yes. My father used to go fishing. He used to go a lot of fishing, bring the fish and my mother dry it on the leaves, put in the baskets. They keep in winter, yes. Father used a lot of, a lot of fishing.

SIGRIST:

What kind of fish?

BROZINSKAS:

Oh, gee. I forgot them. ( she laughs ) I forgot the fishes.

SIGRIST:

Did you eat a lot of fish growing up?

BROZINSKAS:

Yeah, I ate. There you see Mother make soap from the fish, and they make, you know, just warm them up and fry them in the heat.

SIGRIST:

What else do people eat in Lithuania? What other foods did you eat?

BROZINSKAS:

Made bread, cabbage, there's barley. And . . .

POVILAITIS:

Potatoes.

BROZINSKAS:

Potatoes. Potatoes a lot, make a lot from potatoes. From potatoes make all kind of, pancakes, and bake, ash, leave, bake. From potatoes, you make a lot of things from the potatoes.

SIGRIST:

How did you cook the cabbage?

BROZINSKAS:

Cook cabbage? Well, cut in little pieces, eat little pieces and cook in pot, in stove. And put something in, you have some kind of piece of meat put meat together, to stay together.

SIGRIST:

What about desserts? What kinds of sweets did your mother make?

BROZINSKAS:

Sweet, we don't have much sweet, no. Just when you make pancakes, they serve to us.

POVILAITIS:

Blueberries. How about blueberries?

BROZINSKAS:

Oh, blueberries, we don't have much blueberries. No. We have blueberries, not much.

SIGRIST:

What was your mother's name?

BROZINSKAS:

Justina. It's my name.

SIGRIST:

Like your name. And do you know what her maiden name was?

BROZINSKAS:

Jarvis.

SIGRIST:

Can you spell that?

POVILAITIS:

J-A-R-V-I-S.

SIGRIST:

J-A-R-V-I-S.

BROZINSKAS:

Jarvis. She come from a rich family.

SIGRIST:

Tell me about your mother's background.

POVILAITIS:

Tell about your mother. Tell where she came from, your mama. You told me, she was a, she came from where? Rich?

BROZINSKAS:

From same city, Punia.

POVILAITIS:

Yeah, but you told me she came from a rich family.

BROZINSKAS:

From a rich family, yeah. She come from a rich family.

SIGRIST:

Do you know how she met your father?

BROZINSKAS:

Well, in same city. See, sometimes when you go someplace, in the store or someplace, or take care of the animals. And you see each other.

SIGRIST:

What did your mother look like?

BROZINSKAS:

Like, my mother, she don't look like me. I look like, wait a minute. ( she laughs ) I got mistake. Myself and my son doesn't look like my mother, like mother.

SIGRIST:

What color hair did she have?

BROZINSKAS:

Hair? Like mine. She have, not too dark, not too light. Medium brown.

SIGRIST:

What was her personality like?

POVILAITIS:

Was she easy to get along with, your mother? Was she easy, she never got mad, your mother? Was she a nice lady, your mother?

BROZINSKAS:

Oh, everybody used to like my mother. Everybody used to like my mother! All the city used to, all, the time they think she's wonderful woman. Father was, I no like, tell you the truth. I tell you the truth. You see, everybody have a quarrel, and I think she used to take him for witness, Father. He used to go all over for witness, like lawyer. This is, my mother don't like people like that. No. Because she want, when was city, I remember, that she work out, she have small children. Then she work awful hard. She have to go work outside digging potatoes and rye, and the thing. She have to do some, and she took some young fellow. Some girl have a son. She took that boy. He kept her home. That boy there, to my mother, he used to help her all the time. She kept him till he was twenty-one, took him in the service.

SIGRIST:

She raised him.

BROZINSKAS:

Huh?

SIGRIST:

She raised this boy?

POVILAITIS:

Yeah.

BROZINSKAS:

Yeah.

SIGRIST:

She took care of him.

BROZINSKAS:

Oh, yes. He used to live, that boy, with mother, was good, and the boy was very good. Because he used to stay with everything, all got a job, all got a job.

SIGRIST:

So that's why they were fine in the household. What was the boy's name?

POVILAITIS:

What was that boy's name?

BROZINSKAS:

Gee, I can't tell. Now, I don't know. I forgot. I never know that.

SIGRIST:

When you think back to your mother, tell me something that your mother did for you when you were a little girl.

POVILAITIS:

Was your mother, your mother was good to you. What did she do? What did she do for you?

BROZINSKAS:

Oh, she do everything for me. She was very good to children, very, very good to children.

SIGRIST:

Did she like to play games?

BROZINSKAS:

My mother?

SIGRIST:

With the children.

BROZINSKAS:

She don't have time to play. She work. ( they laugh ) She never have time to play nothing. We don't play much because, you know, always working, hardworking, the children was.

SIGRIST:

You had to work as children.

BROZINSKAS:

Uh-huh. I was always working, working. (?) opened up, work. Someplace else, I get a little money.

SIGRIST:

What was your brother's name?

BROZINSKAS:

My brother's? My brother's name is Johnny, like my father.

SIGRIST:

And is he older than you?

BROZINSKAS:

Huh?

SIGRIST:

Was he older than you?

BROZINSKAS:

Uh, my brother live with me.

POVILAITIS:

No, no. ( to Mr. Sigrist ) She didn't hear you.

SIGRIST:

Was he older than you?

POVILAITIS:

Was he older?

BROZINSKAS:

Yes. He was the first one. He was the first one in the family.

SIGRIST:

How many years' difference between you and your brother?

BROZINSKAS:

Between me and brother? Two years all the time. Two years between each other.

SIGRIST:

Did you get along well with your brother when you were kids?

BROZINSKAS:

We get along with everybody, with all of them. Just when he was nineteen years old, he's come in this country, my brother. I remember.

SIGRIST:

But you were here already.

POVILAITIS:

No.

SIGRIST:

When he was nineteen?

BROZINSKAS:

He was nineteen . . .

POVILAITIS:

She was sixteen.

SIGRIST:

She was sixteen years old. He was nineteen.

BROZINSKAS:

I was . . .

POVILAITIS:

Sixteen.

BROZINSKAS:

I think I was just only seven, something, nine years, I guess, when my brother go in this country.

SIGRIST:

Tell me about church. Were your family, your mother and father religious people? Were you religious?

BROZINSKAS:

Catholic, Catholic. We was very good Catholic.

SIGRIST:

Tell me about being Catholic at that time. Tell me about church.

POVILAITIS:

Did you go to church a lot?

BROZINSKAS:

Every Sunday. Every Sunday we go to church. It was good, and the children was in school, Catholic school.

SIGRIST:

Did you go to a Catholic school?

BROZINSKAS:

Yeah.

SIGRIST:

What do you remember about school?

BROZINSKAS:

Well, like in every school, you know, we just went, Catholic more they teach them religion.

SIGRIST:

Were nuns teachers?

BROZINSKAS:

Yes.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember any of your teachers in Lithuania?

BROZINSKAS:

No, no. ( they laugh ) I was, no. Those things, I don't know. Small kids no asking, you know, with those teachers.

SIGRIST:

Did you like school?

BROZINSKAS:

I liked, I used to like school. Just there weren't too many along in school because I just started going to school and say, "Come on, stay home and work." We used to work.

SIGRIST:

What kinds of jobs did you have to do around the house?

BROZINSKAS:

Everything. Cleaning and they used to have, you know, like in old country, weaving.

POVILAITIS:

The spinning wheel.

BROZINSKAS:

Well, that was making the cloth. You have to do a lot of work, pulling the flaxseed. You have to pull them out. You have to take a lot of work make thread and the linen.

SIGRIST:

Did you have a loom in the house?

BROZINSKAS:

What?

SIGRIST:

A loom?

BROZINSKAS:

Have loom and spinning wheel, yeah. We have that.

SIGRIST:

Did your mother make your clothes?

BROZINSKAS:

Everything. Mother make clothes, sew and everything, jackets and pants and everything at home.

SIGRIST:

Can you describe a dress that you had when you were a little girl?

BROZINSKAS:

Well, yeah, yes. Three pieces put together in the back together here. Make just a long dress.

SIGRIST:

What kind of shoes did you wear?

BROZINSKAS:

Shoes? ( she laughs ) When we small kids, we used to be barefoot. Just in wintertime, made from the woods somewhere, from the woods, made, covered with leather, some kind of like, like shoes you need. Doesn't make like that, for wintertime. And summertime there, walking outside bare.

SIGRIST:

Were the adults barefooted also, or just the children?

POVILAITIS:

Did your mother and father wear, barefooted too? Were they barefooted in the summertime?

BROZINSKAS:

Yes.

POVILAITIS:

Yeah?

BROZINSKAS:

Father was not too much bare. He used to wear a kind of boots.

SIGRIST:

When you were a little girl, what did you do for fun? How did you have fun?

POVILAITIS:

When you were a little girl, did you have some good times for yourself? Did you play with your, did you play when you were a little girl? Did you have a good time, play ball or anything?

BROZINSKAS:

No. What I remember, I used to have a little doll, I used to play with dolls.

SIGRIST:

What did the doll look like?

BROZINSKAS:

Well, made from the wood. No, from cloth make dolls. Not like in here, you don't buy dolls. They used to make from the cloth, dolls. Make eyes, make face. ( she laughs ) That's difference.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember how you celebrated Christmas?

BROZINSKAS:

Uh, yes. Christmas, First Night before Christmas, First Night is a big day. They make . . . ( she clears her throat )

POVILAITIS:

Clear your voice, Ma. Clear your voice.

BROZINSKAS:

Before Christmas we have a big day, night. The, all kind of different food that we made. Just different, like from the milk, from the cream, some make, some meals. I can't explain now.

SIGRIST:

Special foods that you had.

BROZINSKAS:

Especially special food for Christmas Night. After for Christmas, well, we have, you know, everything, you know, what we have some meat. Make bread, like pierogi, make pierogi. ( she laughs )

POVILAITIS:

What are you laughing for, huh?

BROZINSKAS:

I'm laughing because that's a laugh, make pierogi for Christmas. ( she laughs )

SIGRIST:

How did you make pierogi?

BROZINSKAS:

Make pierogi?

SIGRIST:

How do you do that?

BROZINSKAS:

Why? ( she laughs ) You have flours. Good, nice, good flours. Mix together, after, you know, you have to work the ends, bake some dough, bake. You bake the pierogi.

SIGRIST:

And that's especially for Christmas.

BROZINSKAS:

Special for Christmas, for the Easter.

POVILAITIS:

How long, you had apples and mushrooms, apples and mushrooms for Christmas, apples, too, didn't you? Apples.

BROZINSKAS:

Apples?

POVILAITIS:

Yeah. Stuff like apples.

BROZINSKAS:

We had bought, made a lot of things. They were from a made, a lot of things for Christmas. So kielbasa, they make, make nice kielbasa for Christmas. All the time is special for Christmas, kielbasa.

POVILAITIS:

Kapusa, cabbage?

BROZINSKAS:

Cabbage, yes. It's a difference to everything.

SIGRIST:

And that's a special Christmas meal.

BROZINSKAS:

Christmas, Christmas Day. Christmas Eve before Christmas don't have any meat, no meat. That way. ( she laughs ) This is a lot of, lots of fun. END OF SIDE ONE BEGINNING OF SIDE TWO

SIGRIST:

Did you give presents for Christmas, too?

BROZINSKAS:

What?

SIGRIST:

Did you give presents for Christmas?

BROZINSKAS:

President?

SIGRIST:

Presents.

BROZINSKAS:

Well, the family, what they did, children need something for buying, yes, buying for a present.

SIGRIST:

Did you have a Christmas tree?

BROZINSKAS:

A Christmas tree? Yes.

SIGRIST:

How would you decorate your Christmas tree?

BROZINSKAS:

Decorate? Well, gee, I forgot what they have. They have some kind of light.

POVILAITIS:

Candles?

BROZINSKAS:

Candles, yes. They have candles, too, yes. For Christmas they have candles, they make some, some stuff. Not light, put anything, you know, on the Christmas.

POVILAITIS:

Decorations?

BROZINSKAS:

Decorations.

SIGRIST:

Was Christmas a fun time for you? Did you enjoy Christmas?

BROZINSKAS:

Oh, yes. Oh, yes. Everybody waiting for the Christmas, especially children. Children waiting for Christmas.

SIGRIST:

When you were a little girl, what did you know about America when you lived in Lithuania?

BROZINSKAS:

You know what we have? People come and dress up nice and bring a little money. This is what I thought. You were going in America, and you get, and things, just pick up. I never thought you have to work for a dollar. I was kind of, when I come in this country, I find out. Because when I want to go to this country, this I wrote to my sister. I have sister here. I want to have, "I come see you, I want over here in America." She send me the passport. When I come here, my brother-in-law told me you have to pay for a guy, he wants money. Money to get passport. You have to pay the guy sixty dollars. I start crying, crying, crying. I said, "You don't just make money, for a day, sixty dollars." I come in that house, and the little girl was like me, my age. She work. You know, I was extended, tell me, make eighteen, because you don't get no job for sixteen. That's true. Put on the paper I'm eighteen. This is, that girl in the same house where my sister lived, she quit job. And my sister said, "Rose, ask your boss. Maybe he give the job for my sister." She asked him, boss said, "Bring her in." Third day, third day when I come from, just in this country, third day she took me, the boss took me. She thought he took me, put on the job, that girl show how to work big machine, forty spools go in, forty bobbins go in one spool. She showed me to the tie up thread. She had to make. Thank God. Four months, I gave her that sixty dollars back, and I (?) sent to old country ten dollars. I don't have no clothes. After that I buy, I make money, I buy clothes for myself and I was all right.

SIGRIST:

Why did you want to leave Lithuania?

BROZINSKAS:

Huh?

SIGRIST:

Why did you want to leave Lithuania?

POVILAITIS:

Why did you want to come to America? Why did you come?

BROZINSKAS:

I thought, you know, you get money for nothing, see. People dressed up nice bring you money. Nobody tell me you have to work. I thought, you know, just up there you go and pick up money.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember what you took with you when you left Lithuania? What did you pack?

POVILAITIS:

When you were coming to America, did you take a suitcase, a bag, or what? What did you take? Clothes, what did you take?

BROZINSKAS:

Nothing. I just dress, was dressed up. I don't take no clothes. Same clothes. I come with the same clothes. I was on the boat ten days with the same clothes.

POVILAITIS:

Yeah. But you had, you had to go in a wagon and all with some other people before you went to Germany. Tell him. Tell him.

BROZINSKAS:

Yes. In Germany, put in one wagon I don't know how many people, one on top of the others, and I have a bag with me, you know, I have a little bit food and some other, I don't know what I have, some else put that in my lap. Then I stop, you have to get out. When I get out from the wagon I can't stand up on my feet. I fell down on the floor because my, it was bad feet, very bad. I was, too much was weighing on my feet, see. They pick me up, you know, in that bring, you know. And I don't know, I get the wagon again, I guess, and bring some in that. And I forgot city. I forgot city that was bringing that in this country, in this country.

POVILAITIS:

Germany, Ma? What are you talking about? I don't know. When you left Lithuania, you told me it took you a whole week with people, you had to hide in a barn before you came to Germany. Then, when you came to Germany, everything was okay. Remember? You told me that. ( addressing Mr. Sigrist ) She forgets, I think.

BROZINSKAS:

All in Germany.

POVILAITIS:

No, no. When you left Lithuania, you were in a wagon with other people.

BROZINSKAS:

Yeah.

POVILAITIS:

And you were afraid the soldiers would see you, so they'd take you back, remember? And you hid in a barn, they put you in a barn somewhere so the soldiers . . .

BROZINSKAS:

Yeah, in the barn, in the hay. Stay overnight on the hay.

POVILAITIS:

So the soldiers won't see you.

BROZINSKAS:

Yeah. Because you have to go through the lines, you know. You know, what the lines . . .

SIGRIST:

Over the border.

BROZINSKAS:

Border. Yes, yes, yes. Then, after my (?) took us, the lady with a daughter, from same city like I am, from Punia. I never know that lady. They just went, after I find out. This wagon go through the woods, from that barn, through the woods on that border.

POVILAITIS:

Border.

BROZINSKAS:

I fell down. I drop, my bag go way down. ( she laughs ) I drop, rolling. It just, we got through. We got through all right.

SIGRIST:

Did your mother and father want you to go to America?

BROZINSKAS:

Don't say nothing, you know. Just I go. They said, "Too young." My father, mother said, "Too young, honey. You should wait." Just when sister sent the passport, I got to go.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember saying goodbye to your mother and father? Do you remember saying goodbye to your parents?

BROZINSKAS:

Oh, yes. Well, yes.

SIGRIST:

Could you describe that for me?

BROZINSKAS:

I kissed her hands. My mother's Father took me, another man come, took me, a man used to come and take from home. He had that place where all people get together going, some place. Father take me from a woman, in a place, from a place. Just like, I kiss his hands and say, "Goodbye, Pa." I said, "Be good to Mother." I told him, I said, "Be good to Mother. Take care of Mother. Don't go like you used to go, for a witness for everybody. Just promise that." He said, "No, I stay home." I don't know, you know, from there where he took us, took, for a (?) money, took again a wagon us. He had some wagon, took from Germany. Go in someplace, I don't know where that city, what city name.

SIGRIST:

And that's where you got the boat to Germany?

BROZINSKAS:

I come in the boat.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember the name of the boat?

BROZINSKAS:

Eh, the uh, uh, something. I think, the boat, I think (?). I can't tell for sure. I take (?).

SIGRIST:

Now, you were on the boat ten days, you said.

BROZINSKAS:

Ten days.

SIGRIST:

Can you describe where you slept on the boat?

BROZINSKAS:

I slept.

SIGRIST:

Where?

BROZINSKAS:

I slept, this is a little room. There's one bed. The bed on top, I slept on the top, on the second bed.

SIGRIST:

Was someone in the room with you?

BROZINSKAS:

Yes, another lady down.

SIGRIST:

What do you remember about being on the boat? What do you remember about being on the boat?

BROZINSKAS:

On the boat?

SIGRIST:

Yes. What do you remember about being on the boat?

BROZINSKAS:

Well, nothing, you know. Just that they gave you the food. I always eat, eat good. All the time got olives, potatoes. Potatoes. ( she laughs ) The guy, he cook, cooking guy. Olives, potatoes. I used to like that. I used to eat good.

SIGRIST:

So you didn't get sick?

BROZINSKAS:

Some people sick, throw up. Others, I never was sick. I never throw up nothing. I used to go on top, on the second floor on the boat. Go down, and I was all right. They was very healthy on the boat.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember being on the deck of the ship, up on deck?

POVILAITIS:

Did you look on the ocean upstairs? Were you on top of the, on top of the boat where you could look in the ocean? Did you see that?

BROZINSKAS:

I see, you know, from the boat we see around, water, water, water.

SIGRIST:

( addressing Mrs. Povilaitis ) Go ahead.

POVILAITIS:

You had to go to the bathroom one night. What happened? You had to go.

BROZINSKAS:

Oh. I, when I lived on the second floor, I used to sleep on the second floor. I didn't want to go to the bathroom. I'd go on the, down. And I'd see them, I had to go on another, on another place, (?). I see black man. When I see black man, I got so scared. I go back in my room, I crawl in myself, and I no go any more in that bathroom. I was scared of that man, see.

SIGRIST:

You had never seen a black person before.

BROZINSKAS:

I never seen black person before. Just it was black as that kind people. ( she laughs ) And I got scared.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember what time of the year this is? What time, what month did you leave?

BROZINSKAS:

What month?

SIGRIST:

Do you remember?

BROZINSKAS:

You mean I come in this country?

SIGRIST:

Yes. When did you, what time of the year?

BROZINSKAS:

In May, I think May, I come. May 10, I think. May 10.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember seeing the Statue of Liberty when you got to America?

BROZINSKAS:

I can't tell that.

SIGRIST:

You don't remember.

POVILAITIS:

When you were on the boat, they gave you a banana.

BROZINSKAS:

Yeah. ( she laughs ) They gave a banana, and I don't know what's that. No, not on the boat.

POVILAITIS:

No?

BROZINSKAS:

When I come in this country.

POVILAITIS:

Oh, okay, okay.

BROZINSKAS:

When I come in this country in the house.

SIGRIST:

Do you remember, do you remember going to Ellis Island when you arrived? Do you remember being processed as an immigrant at Ellis Island?

POVILAITIS:

When you got to New York, you got off the boat, do you remember going in the building there?

BROZINSKAS:

Eh, wait a minute. Gee, I used to, I used to know just now.

POVILAITIS:

Take your time. Go ahead.

SIGRIST:

Take your time.

BROZINSKAS:

In New York . . .

POVILAITIS:

When you got off the boat.

BROZINSKAS:

( she says "Castle Garden" in Lithuanian )

SIGRIST:

In Castle Garden. Castle Garden?

BROZINSKAS:

Castle Garden, I guess.

SIGRIST:

( addressing Mrs. Povilaitis ) That's the European way of saying Ellis Island.

POVILAITIS:

Oh, yeah?

BROZINSKAS:

I forget it.

SIGRIST:

What do you remember about Castle Garden?

POVILAITIS:

What do you remember about the place? What do you remember about Castle Garden? What do you remember? When you got off the boat, Ma? What do you remember? A lot of people? What did they do to you when you got off the boat?

BROZINSKAS:

What they do to you?

POVILAITIS:

When you got off the boat, where did you go?

BROZINSKAS:

I don't go, all the people there, I wanted to get out from there. I thought myself I just get out, and I go, I walk home. I think that. Just when the guy grabbed me. "Where you going?" It was that place, locked, you know.

POVILAITIS:

Gates.

SIGRIST:

Through a gate.

BROZINSKAS:

He said, "Where you going?" And he took me by the hands. He said, "Go back." You know, in that place was a lot of people, this big room. On the floor a lot of straw. On the floor, straw all over. They sleep there all night. All kind of people sleep on the straw. No clothes, nothing, just sleep there. See? Oh, I see a lot of things.

SIGRIST:

What did you see? What do you remember seeing?

BROZINSKAS:

What I see? Well, I mean, I go a lot of things, a lot of things go, good and bad.

POVILAITIS:

When you got there, they examined you? Did they examine you?

BROZINSKAS:

Yeah, examine. My eyes was red. You know, I cry a lot. And he said, "Your eyes not too good. Just nothing infection, nothing grows. Just don't look through the window. Don't look through the window, you know. Just keep eyes down, you'll do all right." Just three days they keep me for that, the eyes. The doctor will examine, examines that, all right. No disease, nothing. "In your eyes, you're all right."

SIGRIST:

So you slept there three days.

BROZINSKAS:

Yeah, yeah.

SIGRIST:

Where did you sleep when you were there?

BROZINSKAS:

On the hay, on the straw, on the floor.

SIGRIST:

And do you remember anything else about being there for three days?

POVILAITIS:

Did they give you any good food? Did they feed you? Did they give you something for eat when you were there for three days? Did they give you something to eat?

BROZINSKAS:

They gave you something. They don't gave you much.

POVILAITIS:

No?

BROZINSKAS:

No, don't give you much.

SIGRIST:

Who came to meet you?

BROZINSKAS:

Huh?

SIGRIST:

Who came to meet you?

BROZINSKAS:

Meet me? Uh, well, I come in this country and I get out from New York near Hazardville. I was in Hazardville supposed to come for us.

POVILAITIS:

Who, when you were in New York how did you get on the train? Who put you on the train when you were in New York? How did you get on the train? Did somebody put you on the train?

BROZINSKAS:

Yes, yes. That way, put me in the train. And I come from New York and Hazardville as a stop. Was trolley car, stop. And I see a man coming. He come, man told me, "Stay there." On the station. I so afraid. Nobody, nobody around. I stood there. I see a man coming from shop was there that far. Black and dirty, my brother. He said, "What you come for?" "I got scared when you saw me like that." "What you come for? You don't have to come?" I start to cry again. Then he said, "Come on." He took me where he lived, in a house. Two girls and all that, a girl comb my hair, and after she says, "Wait there." And my brother go back in shop and work, just he told me, "Stay in this house." I see through the window my car come and my sister get out from the car. My sister come in the house. Oh, I was so glad to see her. I was so glad to see her. Then after, you know, she took me where she lived and put me near the table. A lot of Lithuanian people there. Gave me first a banana. I look at the banana. She said, "You know what to do." I put one on the table. My hands like that. ( she gestures ) My sister, she watches me. After she says, "No, you know what I mean." She took that banana and peeled it and gave it to me. She said, "See what is this? To eat, you have to peel it." You know. After my brother come, and the next day after a girl was there. Same size clothes, that girl gave me, put on me. Wash me, first wash me, put me in the tub. ( she laughs ) Put water in the tub and wash me. ( Mrs. Povilaitis laughs ) And dress me up. That was a lot of fun.

SIGRIST:

Did you have long hair?

BROZINSKAS:

Yes, I have long hair, yeah. Just put my hair, I don't know how. Then after when I, a girl got a job for me, and I start to work, and I was very good.

SIGRIST:

Tell me how you learned English.

BROZINSKAS:

I don't talk English much.

SIGRIST:

You talk very well. How did you learn?

BROZINSKAS:

No, no. I no speak English good. Well, little by little, little by little, little by little. ( she laughs )

SIGRIST:

Did your sister speak English?

BROZINSKAS:

Not that much. You know, not too good, no.

SIGRIST:

How long had it been since you had seen your sister last?

BROZINSKAS:

My, you know my, how long . . .

POVILAITIS:

How long since you saw your sister? When you were in the old country, she was here. How many years was she over here?

BROZINSKAS:

Oh, just one year.

POVILAITIS:

Oh, one year.

BROZINSKAS:

Just one year.

SIGRIST:

When you got to Hazardville, did your sister look different to you?

BROZINSKAS:

No. No, no, no, no. She don't look different. She look very nice, because she have to dress up nice. She look very nice. She have nice clothes.

SIGRIST:

Did people dress differently in America than they had in Lithuania?

BROZINSKAS:

Well, they dress up better, dress up better, yes. In the old country doesn't dress up, you know, what you make, make everything home. Cloth, everything you make. Dress now different. Dress now different, I think like in this country now. You know, when people come, this is (?). Like in this country.

SIGRIST:

Did you miss Lithuania when you were here?

BROZINSKAS:

No, no. Not bad, you know. Because you know why, I make money. I was glad I make money. I have different clothes.

SIGRIST:

And you were sending money home to your parents?

BROZINSKAS:

Yes. Oh, yes. Just I stay, I stay one year, two years, and I got married in this country. Two years, I stayed. I just, just I come in front of, right away we get married. I was just when I come, first day, she ask. "Sister," she said. "Keep up, I go and dress up her. I go and get married her." I don't like fellow that. I don't like fellow. ( Mrs. Povilaitis laughs ) Just after that, I have enough fellow. I'm a small girl, just I have a look at the fellows. I have another fellow used to come, come, nice fellow, but he from the same place, from old country. Same place where my brother-in-law. Nice fellow. Name William (?). Just he used to drink, he used to drink a lot, and I don't like that. I, after another fellow, my cousin lived with another fellow, and the other fellow said, "She, I like, too, that girl." And my uncle wrote you this, that he's coming to you, you should get married him. I will. I got married him. I got married that fellow.

SIGRIST:

What was his name?

BROZINSKAS:

Uh, John.

SIGRIST:

John?

BROZINSKAS:

Brozinskas.

SIGRIST:

John Brozinskas.

POVILAITIS:

Joseph.

SIGRIST:

Joseph.

BROZINSKAS:

Joe Brozinskas. He was a very nice man. He was a good man. I lived with him, uh, I lived a long time with him. After now, he die. He was a very, very good man. Two children. Just he die poor guy, that, well, I think, I don't know how old he was. I forgot.

POVILAITIS:

Seventy-three.

BROZINSKAS:

Something like that, you know.

SIGRIST:

How many children did you have?

BROZINSKAS:

I have four. I lost one.

SIGRIST:

I see. And what year did you get married?

BROZINSKAS:

Huh?

SIGRIST:

What year did you get married?

BROZINSKAS:

What year? ( she laughs ) I don't know.

SIGRIST:

Do you know, a?

POVILAITIS:

Uh, '12, '13, '14. 1914.

SIGRIST:

1914?

POVILAITIS:

Yeah.

SIGRIST:

Mrs. Brozinskas, I want to ask you, we're almost out of time, so I want to ask you a final question. Are you glad that you came to this country?

BROZINSKAS:

Yes, I was glad. I was glad I come in this country. Because you know why? I work and I make, have a little money. And I have nice clothes. I have to eat what I want, and this is difference like in the old country, difference like in the old country. Wouldn't get close. You have to think, you know, how you get. Up here you know how you used to get easy. I was glad.

SIGRIST:

Did you ever see your parents again?

BROZINSKAS:

No, no, no. I never see, no, no. I never see, I no go.

SIGRIST:

You never wanted to go back to Lithuania?

BROZINSKAS:

Well, uh, I used to think go back just when, you know, when started fighting. There's a war, there was fighting, fighting. Took my brother in war, he got wounded in the legs. After that, you know, it stop fighting, stop fighting. And in Lithuania they got back. Well, they got back from Russia. This was a very good country, because the land good. Anything you planted used to grow. Very rich it was, country. Lithuanian build them good, with the, buildings for that shop. It was very good country for twenty years, it got rich. There's Russian again, started fighting again, come back. Because was rich, a rich country. The Russian was a big country. Just not too rich.

SIGRIST:

I want to thank you very much for your time, for letting me talk to you.

BROZINSKAS:

I don't know. I tell how much I could.

SIGRIST:

You did very well.

BROZINSKAS:

I can't tell, you know, some of the things what I know. I don't know, just I tell what I know.

SIGRIST:

Well, this is Paul Sigrist signing off with Justina Brozinskas in Bristol, Connecticut on June 27th, 1993. Thank you.

BROZINSKAS:

You're welcome.

ADDITION:

A LETTER FROM MRS. BROZINSKAS' DAUGHTER, ANNE B. POVILAITIS DATED SEPTEMBER 23, 1994: Dear Mr. Sigrist: I would like to convey to you that my mother, Justina Brozinskas, passed away on July 9, 1994 at the age of 99 years old. Before her death she had related to me several things she forgot to mention in her interview. Her father was known as the beekeeper in her town. Made honey and wax. Candles were made and sold to the church. Honey was sold, too. Christmas Eve was a gathering of family and relatives to partake in a traditional dinner. Nine (9) different Lithuanian dishes were made--however, no meat was served at this meal. Straw was placed in the middle of the table resembling the "baby Jesus" crib. A Host in the form of white, flat bread was passed around for each person to break off and eat, so the Good Lord would enlighten their lives. Hazel nuts were gathered for eating and baking purposes--such as cookies at Christmas. Apples were always eaten as one of their staple fruits. Has several apple trees in their orchard. Used them for baking, too. Feathers from their chickens and geese were used to make pillows and bed covers. In the wintertime and going to church and school they wore wooden shoe, which were made by their father. They also had boots made from leather. Lent was a very holy season. No meat was eaten during the entire 9 weeks. So when Easter arrived much cooking and preparation took place with many Lithuanian specialties made from potatoes, cabbage, flour, meats, sausages, breads, cakes. One beverage they enjoyed was tea. The birch tree was their country tree. Many stories, songs and poems included this tree. Amber is a beautiful gem stone of Lithuania. I hope these few additions may be of interest to you to add to my dear mother's biography. Thank you for your interest. Anne B. Povilaitis (daughter of Justina Brozinskas)