SEAGRIST:

Good afternoon, this is Paul Seagrist for the National Park Service. Today is Sunday, September 24, 1995. Approximately two o'clock in the afternoon. And I am in West Harrison, New York, which is just outside of White Plains, with Helene Morgado. Mrs. Morgado came from Brazil in 1929. She was 12 years old at that time. Present also in the room is her husband, and the neighbor, who has come over to watch this. Mrs. Morgado, can we begin by you giving me your birth date, please?

MORGADO:

May 31, 1917.

SEAGRIST:

And my I have your full name before you were married, please?

MORGADO:

My full name as it appears on my card is Helene Coelho Da Silva Nanta. (laughs)

SEAGRIST:

Can you spell all of that for us please?

MORGADO:

My first name too?

SEAGRIST:

Yes.

MORGADO:

H-E-L-E-N-E C-O-E-L-H-O D-A S-I-L-V-A N-A-N-T-A

SEAGRIST:

And were you named those names for a specific reason?

MORGADO:

Well, as far as I know in Brazil, we used to take our mother's maiden name as well as our father's name, you know, when we were born. The children, in a marriage.

SEAGRIST:

And which one is your mother's maiden name?

MORGADO:

Coelho.

SEAGRIST:

Wow. That's interesting. Do you know anything about your birth? Did your mother or father ever tell you anything about when you were born?

MORGADO:

No.

SEAGRIST:

No? Where were you born in Brazil?

MORGADO:

Belempara.

SEAGRIST:

Can you spell that, please?

MORGADO:

B-E-L-E-M-P-A-R-A

SEAGRIST:

And where in the country is that?

MORGADO:

That's right on, the Equator runs right that. It's right at the mouth of the Amazon.

SEAGRIST:

Can you tell me a little bit about when you were growing up, what that town looked like?

MORGADO:

Well, to me it was a nice town. Just like here. It's a city area where I lived in.

SEAGRIST:

Describe the buildings for me – what a typical building looks like from that part of the world?

MORGADO:

Well, not much different from here, at that time. Of course now, there's a few changes. The last time we went there, we saw a few changes. But the buildings, the houses, the streets...

SEAGRIST:

Did you live in that town until you came to America?

MORGADO:

Yes.

SEAGRIST:

Is there one particular building in that town that sticks out in your mind as a child?

MORGADO:

Well, there was the um, the army headquarters. A few blocks away from there. And there was a park in front of that. And also, in the opposite direction was the church that we used to attend.

SEAGRIST:

Do you remember the name of the church?

MORGADO:

Ah, Nos Senora de Sentisima Trinidad.

SEAGRIST:

Oh, my goodness. (they laugh) May I ask you to spell that?

MORGADO:

Our Lady of the Holy Trinity. (laughing)

SEAGRIST:

Okay, that's good. (they laugh)

MORGADO:

Well, I can spell it in Portuguese if you want me to.

SEAGRIST:

That's okay. Maybe we can do it afterwards. You mentioned the Army barracks. What do you remember about this army...?

MORGADO:

Well, it really wasn't barracks. It was a great big building and then they had like this, oh, I don't know what you call it. A small area where there used to be a guard all the time. I think the officers used to stay there. And they had a constant guard there, and they used to change shifts just like over here, you know, the police change shifts, the guards used to change every once in a while.

SEAGRIST:

And was that something that you could watch?

MORGADO:

Well, it really was no big deal about it. You know, it was just the matter of what we used to do there. They used to have a lot of mango trees, and all the kids used to go, when it was mango time, we used to go to the park and take up mangoes. (laughing)

SEAGRIST:

Tell me a little bit about the house that you lived in. Can you describe what it was made out of, and how it was constructed?

MORGADO:

Well, I lived, it was very similar to one of these, um, condos nowadays. And you know, they were all adjoining. And they had this big fence in the front. Our house was about in the middle. And you had a great big wall. All wooden. And big gates. And we used to have two stories. The first floor used to be our living room, our dining room, and a kitchen, and the bathroom of course. And in the second floor, used to be – no – on the first floor there was also a bedroom for my parents. And all the kids, we slept on the second floor, which was a great big room, just about bigger than this. We all slept there in hammocks. Each one had their hammocks, They had columns, and hooked to the columns and we slept in a hammock.

SEAGRIST:

What were the hammocks made out of?

MORGADO:

Cotton, as far as I know, they were heavy cotton.

SEAGRIST:

And how would you get these hammocks?

MORGADO:

Oh, you had to buy them in a super, in a market.

SEAGRIST:

So it wasn't something that your family made?

MORGADO:

Oh, no. No.

SEAGRIST:

Of course this is an urban area, you said. It's a city. Is there a piece of furniture that sticks out in your mind from that house for some reason?

MORGADO:

Well, we used to have our dining table. Used to be a great big dining table cause we were seven children, plus my father and my mother. And there was a wardrobe that had drawers on the bottom and on the top, I used to use it to hang your clothes up. And that, far as I know, was made out of oak.

SEAGRIST:

Tell me about, did you have electricity in the house?

MORGADO:

No. We still had, not can – kerosene lamps. And we used to have them in every room. And, like if you go from one room to the other, and if you needed more light, you would bring another one and put it there. And around five o'clock, six o'clock, they used to light up. You know, my parents would light up the kerosene lamps.

SEAGRIST:

And running water?

MORGADO:

Yes. That we did.

SEAGRIST:

You mentioned a bathroom.

MORGADO:

Yes. And we had a shower in the bathroom. Which not too many people did. Used to have them outdoors. But we had everything was enclosed.

SEAGRIST:

Was there ever an occasion where the house had to be heated?

MORGADO:

No.

SEAGRIST:

It's hot where you were.

MORGADO:

Yes. Oh, yes. As a matter of fact, we never even had sweaters until my father came here, and he went back with sweaters.

SEAGRIST:

Is there a story that sticks out in your mind from your childhood that reflects the heat and how hot it was at that time?

MORGADO:

Well, it was hot, but there was always a breeze. I don't remember, you know, as a child, I don't remember sweating, or anything like that. Because there always seemed to be a breeze. And then at night, my mother, my grandmother, used to come over. She only lived about a block away from us, and either we'd go to her house, or she'd come to our house and sit outside in the front. We had like a little garden. And talking, and at night I still feel cold. And I used to tell my mother, let's go in the house, cause I'm getting cold. (laughing) But how cold it was, I don't know.

SEAGRIST:

Let's talk a little bit about your parents, and why they were in Brazil – how that all happened. Give me sort of a thumb nail sketch of your parents' family background.

MORGADO:

Okay. My father was born in Portugal. And ah, he came to Brazil for a better standard of living.

SEAGRIST:

Do you know when he went to Brazil?

MORGADO:

When?

SEAGRIST:

When.

MORGADO:

No. That I don't know.

SEAGRIST:

What was his name?

MORGADO:

Jose De Silva Nanta. Then it was changed to Joseph Nanta, to make it easier when he got his citizenship papers.

SEAGRIST:

Can you spell Joseph in Portuguese?

MORGADO:

Jose. J-O-S-E, with a mark on top of the – E.

SEAGRIST:

So do you know roughly how old he was when he first went to Brazil?

MORGADO:

I don't know if he was 18 or 19 years old.

SEAGRIST:

But a young man.

MORGADO:

Yes.

SEAGRIST:

And what work did he find when he got there?

MORGADO:

Right way, I don't know. But I know, before we came, he had had a different business. Like restaurants. And then he was working as a traveling salesman, sales representative, and he used to go to the Amazon with the workers, to take supplies to the people in Amazon.

SEAGRIST:

What kind of supplies?

MORGADO:

Well, house wares. Households, food, clothing. Things like that.

SEAGRIST:

Everyday necessities.

MORGADO:

Yes. Right. Yes.

SEAGRIST:

What was your father's personality like?

MORGADO:

Well, he was very conscious of education. And ah, he was always trying to get, like when we lived here, came here, trying to get the Portuguese people to get together. And he started up quite a few social clubs. In Yonkers. New York City. Mamaroneck. Ossining. Different spots. And then every Sunday, there used to be dance at the one in Yonkers, and it used to be like a family affair. The kids used to dance with their [ ]. It was really nice.

SEAGRIST:

Is there story that you like to tell about your relationship with your father before he left to come to America?

MORGADO:

Oh, yes. Course he used to be away from home, you know, when he used to go to the Amazon.

SEAGRIST:

And that's what you remember him doing, supplying the...

MORGADO:

Yes, right. That's right. And, but, and every time he came back home, he would always take us places. And as I said, we were seven kids. And he used to take turns. Every week, he would take two or three of us either to the museum, to the zoo, anyplace. Sometimes just for trolley ride. And then he should take us what we call a [botekee], that's a [botekee], maybe over here it's translated to a bodega – whatever it is – but they used to have a drink like a ginger ale? And everybody, we used to buy a bag of bonbons to take to the kids that were left home. And every Sunday he used to take turns.

SEAGRIST:

Can you spell that name in Portuguese of the store?

MORGADO:

Botekee. B-O-T-I-Q-U-I-N

SEAGRIST:

Thank you (laughing). You didn't know it was going to be a spelling bee today. (they laugh)

MORGADO:

I'm glad I went to school.

SEAGRIST:

Well, that was going to be my next question. You said your father was very education oriented. Could he read and write?

MORGADO:

Oh, yes. Definitely.

SEAGRIST:

So he was educated. How did his, the importance that he placed on education, how did that affect your life as you were growing up?

MORGADO:

Well, when we came from Brazil, we had to do our school homework, all through school, and in the evening, we used to sit around the dining room table and my two older sisters used to read a paragraph out of the book, that he would assign the day before. And my sister Cathy, she used to have to read during the afternoon, a chapter, and explain the meaning. Translate the meaning. And me, I used to have to teach my younger sister and my brother how to read and spell in Portuguese. And then at night, he used to be like our teacher. You know, we had to go through the whole program with him, and then he would assign us work for the following day.

SEAGRIST:

That's very interesting. That's very interesting. Tell me what your father looked like? Can you describe him in words? Yes, well we're looking at a photograph, but this is an audiotape.

MORGADO:

Well, he had reddish-blonde hair and a mustache. And he weighed, I think, about a hundred and thirty five pounds, and he was about five feet five, five feet seven, around there.

SEAGRIST:

Tell me when you, again, before he left to go to America, what sticks out in your mind about the way your father liked to spend his leisure time. You told the story about taking the kids, that's obviously one thing. What kinds of things did he like to do for himself?

MORGADO:

Well, for himself, he used to go to school practically every evening. He continue going to school, and then when he was home with us, he used to play the accordion and sing, and we used to sing and dance, you know, the kids, until it was time to go to school, to go to bed. (laughing)

SEAGRIST:

Do you remember any of the songs that you used to sing in Portuguese? Back then?

MORGADO:

(mumbling, thinking) I don't remember. (thinking) Maybe it will come to me.

SEAGRIST:

Maybe as we're talking. If you can think of one, I 'd love to have you sing it on tape. Tell me what your mother's name was?

MORGADO:

Catharina Coehlo Nanta.

SEAGRIST:

And can you spell Catharina?

MORGADO:

C-A-T-H-A-R-I-N-A.

SEAGRIST:

And the other names you've already spelled for us.

MORGADO:

Yes. I spelled them before.

SEAGRIST:

Tell me her family background.

MORGADO:

Well, as far as I know, her father was born in Portugal also, and her mother was Brazilian. And I think there were eleven children, I'm not too sure. But they didn't live near us. Only my grandmother, and about three of my relatives lived near us.

SEAGRIST:

Had your mother been born in Brazil?

MORGADO:

Brazil. Yes.

SEAGRIST:

So her parents had come to Brazil.

MORGADO:

No, her mother was Brazilian born. Only her father was born in Portuguese, Portugal.

SEAGRIST:

Is there a story about that? About? That you can think of? Do you know how the grandparents met? Your grandparents met?

MORGADO:

I have no idea. Sorry.

SEAGRIST:

Do you know why her father came to...?

MORGADO:

No. I don't.

SEAGRIST:

Do you know how your parents met?

MORGADO:

No, I don't. (laughing)

SEAGRIST:

Well, tell me, answer some of the same questions that I've asked you about your father, use your mother now. Tell me what her personality was like?

MORGADO:

Well, my mother was very easy going. She was a sweet heart. And she was very religious. And the one thing that she taught us, every Friday, to clean the house cause she says, on Saturday, our blessed mother would visit all the homes and she wanted to make sure that the house was clean. (laughing)

SEAGRIST:

That's one way of getting kids to clean the house. Do you have other things you can tell me that would reflect how religious your mother was? Some of the things that she did.

MORGADO:

Well, we used to go to Catholic school. My father was not Catholic. But he never kept us from our religion.

SEAGRIST:

What was he?

MORGADO:

He was protestant.

SEAGRIST:

Really. Do you know which sect?

MORGADO:

Well, in Brazil, what they have that, they used to call Espiritismo. It's all about the spirits and all that, you know. But I never attended. I never knew, but that's what he, they used to say, so I really don't know.

SEAGRIST:

Can you spell that too, please?

MORGADO:

Espiritismo. E-S-P-R-I-T-I-S-N-O.

SEAGRIST:

Is this a sort of local nature worship?

MORGADO:

Yes. Right. That's what it is, right.

SEAGRIST:

That's interesting.

MORGADO:

And the reason he came from Brazil to the United States is because every time he went to the Amazon, to the, you know. He came back with the malaria. And he always would end up in the hospital. And the doctors told him, either he would have to change his job and go to a different climate or he would have six months to live. So he had an uncle here in um, Provincetown, Massachusetts, who used to be a fisherman. So he wrote to him and asked him if he would sponsor him. So the uncle said he definitely would. He'd be glad to. So my father came, with my oldest brother who was 14 years old.

SEAGRIST:

What year was this?

MORGADO:

In 1923.

SEAGRIST:

So you're how old when he leaves?

MORGADO:

23, 26,

SEAGRIST:

Six years old.

MORGADO:

Six years old, yes.

SEAGRIST:

Do you remember him leaving?

MORGADO:

Oh, yes. I remember crying.

SEAGRIST:

Can you explain to me the circumstances, like the night he left, or something around...

MORGADO:

Well, I mean, the night he left, the neighbors came over to say goodbye, you know, and that's when we were all crying. We didn't want to see him go.

SEAGRIST:

I realize we were talking about your mother and we've sort of gotten side-tracked. But it makes me think, did your father every tell you, or did he ever talk about some of his experiences in the Amazon dealing with these...

MORGADO:

No

SEAGRIST:

He never really talked about...

MORGADO:

No, he never really did. No. Except that he did say it was, to feel sorry for some of the people that were so poor. And he said many times he gave them things just because they looked like they were in need.

SEAGRIST:

And these are the Indians, right?

MORGADO:

Well, Indians, and there was a lot of Portuguese there too, because Brazil is very similar to the United States. You get all kinds of nationalities.

SEAGRIST:

And in a way, I suppose, these are like homesteaders. They're going out into the jungle.

MORGADO:

That's right. Yes, that's right.

SEAGRIST:

Well, let's get back to your mom here. We were talking about her religious preoccupation. Can you tell me how you practices your religion at home?

MORGADO:

Well, we used to say the rosary practically every evening. And we used to go to Catholic school. We used to go to church on Sundays, and as a kid, at that time, I used to sing in a choir at the church, and in school. We used to go to processions. And my mother was always there for us. She was always with us.

SEAGRIST:

What language did you pray in?

MORGADO:

Portuguese.

SEAGRIST:

Is there a Portuguese prayer that you remember that you could say for us on tape?

MORGADO:

Well, Our Father?

SEAGRIST:

Yes. If you can do it in Portuguese. Great.

MORGADO:

[recites the Our Father in Portuguese] I don't remember any more.

SEAGRIST:

That's okay. That's great. Thanks. What was the language of the church service? When you went to church, what language was it conducted in?

MORGADO:

Latin.

SEAGRIST:

It was in Latin.

MORGADO:

Latin. Yes. The prayers.

SEAGRIST:

The prayers. And what about in, you said you went to a Catholic school. What language was spoken in the school?

MORGADO:

Portuguese. We speak Portuguese all over.

SEAGRIST:

Who were the teachers at the school?

MORGADO:

Well, we had some, I believe they were nuns. And once or twice a week, a priest would come to the school and we had like catechism. (rustling noises)

SEAGRIST:

Whey don't you put the paper up here on the table, cause you're making noise.

MORGADO:

Oh, I'm sorry.

SEAGRIST:

That's okay. Do you have any stories about the nuns?

MORGADO:

No, except they were very nice. And the school we used to go to, if you just went in the morning, you didn't have to pay. But if you wanted to go in the afternoon, then your parents had to pay, I don't know how much it was, but then you could learn different hobbies. You know, crafts. Arts and crafts, or you could continue with your reading and writing, you know. Things like that.

SEAGRIST:

Were there things, certain household things that your mother taught you at home?

MORGADO:

Well, she taught us how to clean. How to keep ourselves neat and clean. And never to lie.

SEAGRIST:

What about like actual things to do. For instance, handiwork. Were you taught how to embroider?

MORGADO:

Oh, embroider, crochet, sewing. No knitting, because we didn't need, you know. And they used to have making lace by tatting. There was a pillow, like out of straw, filled with straw, and then they used to have all these different things, and with the threads and the pins you make the different styles of the lace.

SEAGRIST:

And then what would you use the lace for?

MORGADO:

Well, some people used to sell them if they made a lot, you know. But at home we used to make like embroidery of our slips, or doilies for the tables.

SEAGRIST:

So you pretty much made it for your own use.

MORGADO:

Oh, yes. Just to train us. Just to keep us busy.

SEAGRIST:

Where did your clothes come from?

MORGADO:

Well, our clothes, my father used to have, she was a distant cousin. She was a deaf, mute. And twice a year she used to come to our house for two weeks, and she used to make all our clothes. Underwear, slips, dresses. And my father had a habit, the three girls, younger girls, would all dress alike and the two older sisters would dress a like. But the boys were different.

SEAGRIST:

How did the girls feel about having to dress alike?

MORGADO:

We didn't mind it at all.

SEAGRIST:

You just accepted it.

MORGADO:

You just accepted it, that's right.

SEAGRIST:

Is there a dress, or one or two dresses that stick out in your mind from your childhood, that you remember vividly for one reason or another?

MORGADO:

Well, we had, one was blue and white stripes. Long sleeve, with a white collar. We all had – you know, the three girls. And the other one, was ah, like a pink silk. That was our dressy dress. With the embroidery on the top, with a collar. And that was short sleeve. And that was a pleated skirt. And we felt very comfortable in it.

SEAGRIST:

And these were things that the distant cousin would have made for you?

MORGADO:

Yes. Of course my father used to pay her, you know.

SEAGRIST:

You mention that you have quite a few brothers and sisters.

MORGADO:

Two. Two brothers and five sisters. We were five girls and two boys.

SEAGRIST:

Can you list everybody from the oldest to the youngest?

MORGADO:

Yes. My oldest brother's name was Armando.

SEAGRIST:

And if they're Portuguese names, please spell them.

MORGADO:

Yeah. A-R-M-A-N-D-O. My oldest sister was Clara, C-L-A-R-A. My other sister was Maria. M-A-R-I-A. And then Catharina, C-A-T-H-A-R-I-N-A. And I was the next one. H-E-L-E-N-E or – N-A, whichever. And then was my brother Albert. A-L-B-E-R-T. And my sister Cecilia. C-E-C-I-L-I-A.

SEAGRIST:

And how many, what is the span from the oldest to the youngest?

MORGADO:

Gee, we were all about three years apart. About 14.

SEAGRIST:

Do you remember the birth or births of one of your younger siblings?

MORGADO:

Well, my sis-, my brother Al's birth was March 2 nd . He was the youngest one. No, my sister Ciel was the youngest, sorry. And her birthday is April 18. My sister Mary's birthday was March 27. My sister Clara's birthday was July 17, and my brother Armando's birthday was December 25.

SEAGRIST:

Christmas baby.

MORGADO:

Yup.

SEAGRIST:

I guess what I meant by the question was, do you remember when any of the younger siblings when they actually were born, do you remember the circumstances around their birth?

MORGADO:

well, I only remember my sister Ciel was born. Cause my father had just come to the United States. My mother was pregnant at that time. And I remember she, she had the baby at home. And ah, I guess she was having a hard time, because my grandmother and the ah, the midwife, told my sister Clara to go and get my uncle. He worked a few blocks away from, because they needed help, my mother might have to go to the hospital. So my sister, I said, let me go with you. So I went with her. We ran all the way. It was like from here, the distance from here to White Plains. To Main Street in White Plains. And we ran, and we told him, he used to have a tobacco shop. Store. And he left, and we, by the time we got home, my sister had been born.

SEAGRIST:

Can you talk a little bit about when a woman was pregnant, how she presented herself, or didn't present herself? I mean, what were the rules around that sort of thing?

MORGADO:

Well, she had clothes like we have here.

SEAGRIST:

Maternity clothes.

MORGADO:

Maternity clothes. Yes. At least where we came from. You know, we were. I don't know what they did in the interior.

SEAGRIST:

Would your mother go out into public for any reason, when she was pregnant?

MORGADO:

Sure. Why not?

SEAGRIST:

Yeah. And how was all of that explained to the kids, do you remember?

MORGADO:

No. That one thing they never mentioned. We just took it for granted that we're gonna have another brother or sister and that was it. (laughs)

SEAGRIST:

Well, you said your father went in 1923 because hew as getting malaria a lot. Do you remember any instances when he had malaria and how it was treated?

MORGADO:

Oh, he always had to go to the hospital.

SEAGRIST:

And do you know how it was dealt with at that time?

MORGADO:

No. I know at that time they used to give him a kind of medication. I can't remember the name. And I remember because his urine used to turn blue. And the one time they explained, you know, that that's reason, because of the medication that the gave him.

SEAGRIST:

What about, actually, this makes me think, were there household remedies that your mother would make at home, or to deal with common ailments that you can remember at that time?

MORGADO:

Well, she used to make for colds, she used to make a tea out of the skin of lemon and garlic, honey, ah, a little bit of black pepper and a little bit of water. And we used to have that like as a syrup for cold. For a bad cold, or... And if you had [ ] you used to put plaster padding, heat it up, and they used to put that on your chest and on your back.

SEAGRIST:

Do you remember as a child an instance where you were very ill?

MORGADO:

Well, I was always sick. As a matter of fact, my father was always tell, all his friends, that I was very fragile. And he used to take me, when he was home, he used to always to take me with him. Because the doctor says that if I lived up to the age 14, then I would have no problems. But he was always afraid that by the age of 14, I'd be gone because I was always sick.

SEAGRIST:

What kinds of things?

MORGADO:

Bronchitis. Which left me with Brochiatisis, according to the doctors. Did permanent damage to my bronchial tubes and my lungs.

SEAGRIST:

Do you remember how that was treated and what you would have to do, where they put you, and what they did to you?

MORGADO:

No. Just as I said, mustard plaster on the chest and then drinking that tea. That's how I was to be treated. And once in a while, my mother should take me to the doctor, or sometimes just to the drugstore, because the druggists up there were just like a doctor. They gave you, they told you what medication to take and all that. And the doctors used to agree with it.

SEAGRIST:

I haven't asked you actually, what kinds of foods did you eat?

MORGADO:

Just like here. The main food there is what we call feijoada.

SEAGRIST:

Can you spell that please?

MORGADO:

That's Feijoada. F-E-I-J-O-A-D-A.

SEAGRIST:

Thank you.

MORGADO:

And that is black beans, and you have like a dried beef, smoked meats. The meat is cooked with the beans and then on the side, they serve white rice. Plain cooked rice. And then they usually with that, they would serve, not to the children of course, ah, not the whiskey, what do you call that? Yeah. They call it cashasha. A tequila. With a lot of sugar. They used to put the sugar in it, with a piece of lemon, and they used to squeeze the lemon, and they used to serve that. As a matter of fact, they do that in a restaurants. Every time, the last time we went to Brazil, and on Saturday nights, the restaurants all had that specialty.

SEAGRIST:

Can you spell. Cashasha?

MORGADO:

Cashasha. C-A-C-H-A-D... Wait. C-A-C-H-A-C-A. And the C has a little hook on the bottom that changes it from a – ka, to – sha.

SEAGRIST:

I see. And that's a typical Brazilian kind of thing.

MORGADO:

Yes.

SEAGRIST:

What about for special occasions. Like say, for a religious holiday like Christmas or something. Was there a special food that was prepared for that occasion?

MORGADO:

Well, as I said the feijoada.

SEAGRIST:

That would be it.

MORGADO:

Then they'd have, sometimes they'd have festivals and they used to make these ah, (thinking) Can't think of the name. It's coconut. The milk from the coconut and ah, hm? They used that a lot down south. It looks like white corn?

SEAGRIST:

Corn meal?

MORGADO:

No it's not corn meal. It's....

SEAGRIST:

Grits?

MORGADO:

Grits. But whole grits and they would cook that in the coconut milk. With sugar and then they put cinnamon on top and they used to sell that, or your parents would make that as a treat for the kids. Or French toast. My father used to make a lot of French toast as holidays. And one holiday, he always did the cooking. The big holidays, but especially Christmas. Cause it was my mother's day off. And he used to do all the cooking.

SEAGRIST:

Did he do that in America, as well as in Brazil.

MORGADO:

Yes. That he did.

SEAGRIST:

So that was another way that he, something he enjoyed doing.

MORGADO:

Right. Mm, hm.

SEAGRIST:

All right. Your father goes to America in 1923 because, for his health, basically.

MORGADO:

Right.

SEAGRIST:

What does he do when he gets here in '23?

MORGADO:

Well, I don't know at that time, oh! I think he worked in the factories in Massachusetts. END SIDE A BEGIN SIDE B

SEAGRIST:

Did he go to Provincetown?

MORGADO:

Yes. He was there for a while, then he went to New Bedford. And from New Bedford, then he came to Yonkers. And when we came to Yonkers, he was working for the Bronxville Nursery.

SEAGRIST:

What is the span of time from the time he goes to Provincetown, 'til the time he gets to Yonkers, do you think?

MORGADO:

Gee. About a couple of years, maybe a year.

SEAGRIST:

So it took a while.

MORGADO:

Yes. Yes. Mm, hm.

SEAGRIST:

How did your life at home change, if it changed, after your father went to America in '23?

MORGADO:

No, it didn't change because he used to send my mother, regularly, every month, a check. You know, for our, to take care of us. And the only thing that changed was, because my mother was always very kind-hearted. Anybody that came to the house, asking for anything, she would feed them. She would let them sleep, spend the night or whatever it was. And my father didn't go for that because he was always afraid that we would catch something from the other people. And whenever he was away, we always had somebody, some outsider that we never knew, that my mother would take in.

SEAGRIST:

I can see where he would be a little concerned in situations like that. So he's sending money regularly.

MORGADO:

Right.

SEAGRIST:

Did your mother seek employment out of the house at all during that time?

MORGADO:

No. They didn't. Before, what she used to do, is there's somebody coming, do the work, the housecleaning.

SEAGRIST:

What about, you mentioned grandparents down there, grandmother.

MORGADO:

I never knew my grandfather.

SEAGRIST:

Just your grandmother.

MORGADO:

Yes. Mm, hm.

SEAGRIST:

Did she help out financially while your father was gone?

MORGADO:

No. Because my uncle supported her. He used to work and then support my grandmother.

SEAGRIST:

Do you have a story about your grandmother from your childhood?

MORGADO:

Well, it's just that I was very close to her. I loved her very much. I was always up her house. (laughs)

SEAGRIST:

Did she live by herself?

MORGADO:

No. She lived with my uncle and it was a single uncle. And there was a married uncle and his wife. His wife, the wife was my aunt, really. And her husband, and they had two children. And they all lived with my grandmother. All in the same house. It was a big house.

SEAGRIST:

And close to you, I think you said.

MORGADO:

Yes. Just a couple blocks, not even that much.

SEAGRIST:

When you were growing up, maybe while your father's in America, what did you know about America? How did you think about America when you were a little girl in Brazil?

MORGADO:

To be honest with you, I really didn't. I really never gave it a though until my father wrote home, because he, for a while he was working as a, in a ship, so that he could go back and forth without paying. You know, so he used to work aboard the ah, ships and that's how he used to visit us.

SEAGRIST:

So he did come down occasionally to see you.

MORGADO:

Oh, yes. Oh, that he did. And then he ah, wrote home. He wanted to know if mother would like to come to the United States cause it would be much easier, you know, and he would like to have the family back here to, you know, all together. So my mother, first she didn't want to come. But we all as kids, come on Mom, let's go. Let's go, come on! So she agreed to it. But I give her a lot of credit because a life over here for her was all together different. She didn't know anyone. She didn't know the language.

SEAGRIST:

What were her fears about coming? Why didn't she want to come initially?

MORGADO:

Well, because she felt she was leaving her mother, she was leaving her family. And she just didn't know America and she was afraid that she wouldn't be able to get along here. You know, it would be cold in the winter, and she didn't know just how we would get used to it.

SEAGRIST:

Did your father come back down to Brazil to get you?

MORGADO:

Yes, he did.

SEAGRIST:

He did. How long was he in Brazil before you all left? Was he down there...?

MORGADO:

Gee, I really don't know. All I know, he went to get our passports and, you know, to get every, to get all the legal papers and make arrangements on the boat for us to come here.

SEAGRIST:

Do you remember packing to leave?

MORGADO:

Oh, yes.

SEAGRIST:

What sticks out in your mind about that whole process of getting the house ready, and getting yourselves ready?

MORGADO:

Well, my uncle, my father's brother, the one that had the tobacco shop, he took over our house. I mean, where we lived. The furniture, everything was left to him. And ah, we just packed our clothes that my father felt that we needed. Because he felt after we got here, then he would be able to dress us the way, you know, like for winter clothes and things like that. But our clothes that we had were just like here. As a matter of fact, when we when we went to school, the teachers said, did you bring that from Brazil? Did you bring that from Brazil? The were surprised because we were dressed just like over here.

SEAGRIST:

Right, and she was probably expecting...

MORGADO:

They thought that we were Indians, you know what I mean? (laughing)

SEAGRIST:

Yeah. Do you remember objects that you packed? Aside from the clothes, what objects did you take, if any?

MORGADO:

I don't think we brought any.

SEAGRIST:

Did you bring anything that was uniquely yours? Like a toy or a book or something like that?

MORGADO:

No. No. I don't remember that.

SEAGRIST:

Do you remember how your other brothers and sisters felt? I mean, did any of your other, one of your brothers was already here.

MORGADO:

Right.

SEAGRIST:

Did one of the brothers or sisters not want to come, like your mother didn't want to come?

MORGADO:

No. Nobody ever mentioned anything. We said, whatever my mother decided we would go along with.

SEAGRIST:

Was there any kind of a send-off given to you before you actually left your town?

MORGADO:

Well, just our close friends, you know, our neighbors. They came over to say goodbye. My relatives.

SEAGRIST:

Where did you have to go to get onto the ship?

MORGADO:

Oh, to the port. Wherever the ships left. You know, from the land. I don't know the name of the...

SEAGRIST:

How did you get from your town to the port?

MORGADO:

We walked. It wasn't too far from where we lived.

SEAGRIST:

Oh, I see. So you were pretty close to the ocean from where you are.

MORGADO:

Yes. Uh, huh. The Amazon River. (laughing)

SEAGRIST:

You walked with your luggage?

MORGADO:

No. My father, my father carried the luggage. And my mother. And a couple of our friends came over. And my uncle. They took whatever, you know, so that we wouldn't have to carry anything.

SEAGRIST:

How did you feel about leaving? I mean, you're old enough. I mean, you're twelve. You're old enough, you're in school. You've got a life in this town. How did you feel about being uprooted like that?

MORGADO:

Well, the only thing I felt is that I was leaving my grandmother behind. That really would bother me. And the day that we left, we're on our way to the ship. We had to pass where my grandmother lived. Like from here to the corner. And they were all there waving to us, and I felt like taking off and running and giving her a last hug and a kiss. (laughing) But we just waved and we kept on going.

SEAGRIST:

What was the name of the ship?

MORGADO:

Stephen.

SEAGRIST:

Can you spell that please.

MORGADO:

S-T-E-P-H-E-N.

SEAGRIST:

And did you have to wait any period of time before you could get on the ship when you arrived in the port?

MORGADO:

No. We just went on. You know, we boarded the ship. My father had all our passports ready and then we just go on board the ship.

SEAGRIST:

Did you have to under go any kind of medical examination prior to getting on the ship?

MORGADO:

Yes, we did. Yes. And as a matter of fact, when we got to America, I was scared stiff because I had fallen in a hole. See we had been to a procession during the day and I was very tired...

SEAGRIST:

This is still in Brazil?

MORGADO:

This was still in Brazil, yes. And my sister had gone to her neighbor's house. She asked my mother if she could visit her neighbor. So it was about eight thirty. My mother felt that she should be home. So she told me to go tell Clara that it's time for her to come home. So I was tired, so I didn't go, look where I was going. It was just about the next block from our house, you know, the same street. And I never noticed that the workers had been working on the water system, whatever it was, and there was a hole. And I fell in the hole. And I scraped my leg.

SEAGRIST:

This is your right leg, right in the middle of the shin.

MORGADO:

My right leg. Yes. Right. Yes. And ah, I went home, naturally, you know, and my mother scolded me because she said, I should have been paying attention to where I was going. But she washed it, you know, took care of it. But then it got very, very infected. And, as a matter of fact, when my father went, my leg was all swollen. And he took me to the doctor, and the doctor says, well, it's pretty bad infection, because you could almost see the bone. That's how, you know... And he says, well, I'll give you the medication. And ah, I don't know what he gave me. He gave me an injection of some kind. (clears throat) And medication to put on my leg. And that I should always keep it covered. So then I was told, that maybe when we got over here, it hadn't healed. Maybe they wouldn't let me get off the boat. So I was petrified. I says, suppose they don't let me get off. I have to back to Brazil and my family stays here. So when I was going, when we were in Ellis Island by now, and ah, I was shaking. I was actually shaking of fright. So the doctor asked me, why are you shaking, are you afraid? I said, yes. He says, why? So I told him, said, about my leg. Cause I was told that I may not be allowed to leave the boat. So the doctor looked at it, you know, and he asked me how it happened. So I told him. He says, look honey. (laughs) Don't be afraid. Because that is not contagious. We only keep people here that are contagious. And you are not contagious. (laughing) I started to cry. (laughing.

SEAGRIST:

How long before you left to get on the ship did that happen? When did you fall in the hole in regard to when to when you got on the ship?

MORGADO:

Oh, it was about a month.

SEAGRIST:

That's a chunk of time. I'm just curious. Were you the only one in the family who was worried about this?

MORGADO:

Yes. Well at least the other ones never mentioned anything. You know, we never discussed it. But I was just afraid.

SEAGRIST:

So you, tell me about, you got to the ship. Tell me about the accommodations. What did it look like where you stayed on the ship?

MORGADO:

Well, at first, we were overcrowded. We had a lot of people going to um, oh, some port on the way. And we had to sleep, we were about 16 people, children and women, all in one bunk. You know, I mean each one had their own bunk beds, but we were all in one room. But we didn't think anything of it.

SEAGRIST:

And am I to understand then that the men were separated from the women. Women and children in one room.

MORGADO:

Oh, yes. Yes. Yes. Right. Yes. And then, when they got off, these people got off this place, then was different. Because we had the ah, place to our selves, and the captain of the boat was very nice. I was very, very seasick. I couldn't even walk. So he used to take me every morning with my father, one holding on each side, for me to walk around the deck, for me to get my strength back. And thank god, you know, I finally got over, you know, but not as bad, you know, not as good as I would have liked to, but I thought he was very, very nice. But every morning, every night, he used to come and take, with my father, make me walk around.

SEAGRIST:

What time of the year is this?

MORGADO:

In June.

SEAGRIST:

June of 1929.

MORGADO:

Right.

SEAGRIST:

: All those people that were crowded with you – who were they? Or what were they?

MORGADO:

Oh, I can't think of the name of the place. They were blacks, most of them.

SEAGRIST:

Maybe going to the Caribbean somewhere?

MORGADO:

No, it was, well, Caribbean wherever it was. I know that, you know, and then we had, some ship had trouble aboard the ship, and they didn't have a doctor. So our ship had a doctor, and we went out of our way to help. I don't know if they had an accident, somebody was hurt or what it was, but they needed a doctor. And our boat was the closest to them. So we went out of our way, close to two weeks, by the time we got there and back to our...

SEAGRIST:

So it took two weeks to go from Brazil to New York.

MORGADO:

Oh, yes.

SEAGRIST:

Wow. Tell me where they fed you on the boat?

MORGADO:

Where?

SEAGRIST:

Yeah. And what?

MORGADO:

Yeah. Well, they used to have big tables in the deck. Which was very nice, as you were eating, you could see the water. You know, it was very nice.

SEAGRIST:

Right up on deck, you ate.

MORGADO:

Yes. Mm, hm. Yes. And of course, they had also windows, in case of rain or bad weather. And ah, the food was regular. Eggs for breakfast. Toast. And ah, stews, beef. Potatoes and meat and rice. And you know, regular food.

SEAGRIST:

Was this a Portuguese ship, or an American ship?

MORGADO:

No. I think it was English line. I think it was an English...

SEAGRIST:

Tell me about your brothers and sisters on the ship, and if there's a story that you remember about something that may have happened to one of them on the ship .

MORGADO:

No. We all used to play together. We used to sing. There was some man that used to play the guitar, you know. And we used to go on the deck and sing. We, my brothers and sisters, we all got along. Always got along. And we used to stick for each other. If one got hurt something, or you did something wrong, we would always try to hide it so they wouldn't be punished. (laughing)

SEAGRIST:

Did something happen like that on the ship?

MORGADO:

No. The only thing I can remember is that my sister Clara tried to cut my sister Mary's hair. She didn't like the way my sister Mary's hair was cut. So when she tried to cut it over here, she cut a little nip no the earlobe. And she was so scared, you know. But then the ship doctor came, sorry, the ship doctor came, said, don't worry about it. That's nothing. But she was more afraid of my father punishing her.

SEAGRIST:

After all those people got off at whatever port that was, did you still have to be segregated where you slept? Did the women still sleep together?

MORGADO:

Well, then we were the only ones. My mother and about three other women that came from Brazil. And the kids.

SEAGRIST:

Oh, I see. I thought maybe you know, like a hundred people got off and a hundred people were still on.

MORGADO:

Oh, yeah. But they had different. No. We weren't that many on. But ah, you know, they had different rooms, different people slept in. But ah, after they left, there was a lot of people that got off the boat. Barbados.

SEAGRIST:

Barbados.

MORGADO:

Barbados. (laughing)

SEAGRIST:

I'm just curious. Did your mother, in later years, cause she sort of, she has her doubts about all of this, did she ever tell you later about how she felt about being on that ship? Her feelings?

MORGADO:

No. No. No.

SEAGRIST:

I can only imagine a lot of things are going through her mind.

MORGADO:

Yeah, but she didn't say anything. Except the day of the, that we were about to land, my father made us all get up early to see the Statue of Liberty. He made sure that we get room. That we're at the top, to see the Statue of Liberty. And my mother got a big thrill out of that too, you know.

SEAGRIST:

Did you, as a child, know what that was?

MORGADO:

Statue of Liberty? Well, my father tried to explain to us, how it was donated to United States. And to, for the people that needed to come to the United States, they would be welcome in the United States.

SEAGRIST:

All right, so you're in New York. The ship comes into New York, and you're taken to Ellis Island.

MORGADO:

Right, yes.

SEAGRIST:

What else sticks out in your mind about being at Ellis Island. You've mentioned the exchange with the doctor.

MORGADO:

Right. And then another thing is that I looked around, all the women were dressed in black. Black shawls, their head, only their face, could see their face. Black outfit. Except my mother. I was so happy. So proud of her. She had this beautiful blue dress on. (laughing) That to me, you know, I'm so glad my mother never dressed like that. (laughing.

SEAGRIST:

Were you curious about why this was? Had you ever seen anything like this before.

MORGADO:

Well, no. Some of them, they were coming other places, see. And they didn't speak Portuguese. So we really, my father, he was very nice. But he had, what shall I say, he wouldn't let us associate with people that he felt was below us. See? And aboard the ship, except the few that came from where we live, in our area, we were not allowed to associate with anybody. So we had that.

SEAGRIST:

And here you're at Ellis Island where there are probably lots of people he doesn't want you associating with.

MORGADO:

Right. Not only that. I mean there are people from Russian, from all over, the world. And they didn't speak the language. And we just stayed in our own group.

SEAGRIST:

Did your father speak any English at this point, having been in America?

MORGADO:

Well, he spoke a little bit, yes. Because he went to school, evening school. He used to go to evening school, to learn.

SEAGRIST:

Do you remember, and you may not, but that whole exchange with the doctor. Was there an interpreter who was there?

MORGADO:

No. The doctor spoke Portuguese.

SEAGRIST:

Did they examine you for anything else that you can remember?

MORGADO:

Well, I remember like a complete physical.

SEAGRIST:

So they gave you a physical.

MORGADO:

Complete physical. Yes.

SEAGRIST:

What else sticks out in your mind about what you saw on the island? Like maybe where the physical was.

MORGADO:

Oh, you mean in there. It was small room, you know, and you took your turn. They would call you and take you in there. And they had all different areas.

SEAGRIST:

You started to say something and I interrupted you.

MORGADO:

Well, when the Statue of Liberty, and in the grounds around, we thought it was just beautiful. You know, the scenery, the sights around. And then towards New York, all the big buildings, (laughing) you know.

SEAGRIST:

Did they feed you at Ellis Island?

MORGADO:

No. I don't remember. I don't think so. Because I know my father had friends, a friend with a car, and my brother had a car, was there in a car to pick us up. And from there we went right to a restaurant.

SEAGRIST:

In New York City.

MORGADO:

In New York City, yes. But I don't know.

SEAGRIST:

So once you got off of Ellis Island, you went to the restaurant.

MORGADO:

Went to the restaurant, right.

SEAGRIST:

What sticks out in your mind about that first day in New York, going to the restaurant? What things did you see that you had never seen before, that were new to you?

MORGADO:

Well, actually, nothing.

SEAGRIST:

Cause you came from sort of a city.

MORGADO:

Was a city.

SEAGRIST:

Do you remember what you ate at the restaurant?

MORGADO:

No, I really don't. To be honest with you, I don't. I thought, I tried to think about it before, you know, but never...

SEAGRIST:

Well, there's no reason why you should remember necessarily. (they laugh) Where did you go after you ate?

MORGADO:

We went to Yonkers. We went to live at 2 Lawrence Street in Yonkers.

SEAGRIST:

Describe the house or the apartment?

MORGADO:

Well, this used to be a boarding house. The people that ran it were Portuguese. And ah, used to, they had about four or five boarders. But you know, they had a big house, big place. And we had two floors for ourselves. And we stayed there a few weeks, then my father got an apartment for us. On South Broadway. And there from, we lived there until just about a year before I got married, to Morris Street. Which used to be a very nice area now, before, but now I understand it's... (chuckles knowingly)

SEAGRIST:

So the Morris Street apartment, you were there for quite a long time.

MORGADO:

No. No. No. South Broadway, we were there. Right at the corner of McClain Avenue. There was a park across the street. And we used to go to the park. Or we used to go to ah, oh, right at the border of New York, the park there. We used to walk, to the other park. I can't think of the name.

SEAGRIST:

Tell me about going to school. Registering for school and actually going there. And what that was like. M Well, we lived close to School #3, which is only about three blocks away from our school. Well, we couldn't go there because we didn't know the language. And they didn't have a special teacher. You know, to get us started. So they sent us to School #19, which was about two miles away from where we lived. And we had to walk, there's no buses at that time. You walked. And there was no cafeteria. We used to have our lunch packed. And we used to eat outside. Until the janitor, he got acquainted with us, and when he realized that we were eating outside, you know, he asked us, he said you can come in the school, sit on the stairs here, eat your lunch, and then you can go out. Call me and I'll unlock the door for you. And that's what we did. We did that for a few years. Until the fourth grade teacher saw us sitting on the stairs. He said, what are your kids doing in school?! We said, we're eating our lunch. And she couldn't understand that. So she said, you don't belong here. So she went to the principal, and then we were transferred to School #3. Course by then, we know the language, you know, and how to read and write.

SEAGRIST:

How? How did you learn English?

MORGADO:

Oh, there used to be this teacher. And there used to be five Italian students. And in the morning and in the afternoon, we used to go to her. Her name used to be, I'll never forget, Miss De La Sorti. She was an Italian. And she used to explain "chair", and how to pronounce it, and what it was, you know, and that's the way we learned.

SEAGRIST:

Do you remember the first word in English that you knew?

MORGADO:

All right. Come on. And, "yes." (laughing)

SEAGRIST:

What about your mother? Did she make an attempt to learn English?

MORGADO:

She did, but she didn't have friends that spoke English. When she became acquainted with Portuguese, they spoke Portuguese, so that's...

SEAGRIST:

And was there a large Portuguese community where you lived?

MORGADO:

Oh, yes. Oh, yes. In Yonkers. But we only associated with them on Sundays at the socials. But as far as visiting, there were only two families that were allowed, that used to come to our house, and we could go to their house. But not to the other. My father just didn't want us.

SEAGRIST:

Your father would allow you to associate with these two families, but would prefer that you not with the other.

MORGADO:

Yeah. Right. Yes. Mm, hm.

SEAGRIST:

And what was your father doing again, at this time?

MORGADO:

At that time, I know he was working for the Bronxville Nursery.

SEAGRIST:

Doing? What exactly?

MORGADO:

I don't know. I don't know if he was gardener, or if he was a salesman there. I really don't know.

SEAGRIST:

As a child in Yonkers, did you ever experience any kind of bigotry or prejudice against you because you were a foreigner at that time? Did kids make fun of you?

MORGADO:

You mean in Brazil?

SEAGRIST:

No. No. In Yonkers.

MORGADO:

In Yonkers. Well, the only thing they used to ask, every time – did you bring that from Brazil? Did the clothes, is that the clothes? I mean, they couldn't get over that ah... But otherwise they were all very friendly. Very nice. And I had, I was in the sixth grade, when my, when we had a test. We were studying about different countries. And we had been studying about Brazil. And we had a test, and one of the questions was, what languages is spoken in Brazil? So I put Portuguese. And the teacher marked it wrong. When I got my paper back I noticed it, and I raised my hand, and she said, yes? I said, you marked this question, I read the number, wrong, and I'm right. So she got all, she says, come over here. So I went, and as I was walking, you know, to her desk, I was sitting in the back row, and ah, I told her, said, we speak Portuguese in Brazil, not Spanish. And she didn't like that. She told me I embarrassed her in front of the class. And I had to stay one week after school, because I embarrassed her in front of the class. That was the only, you know, incident that we had.

SEAGRIST:

Well, of course you were right.

MORGADO:

Well, but I made her, you know.... (they laugh)

SEAGRIST:

What about night school? Did your parents ever attend night school?

MORGADO:

My father always did. And my two older sisters.

SEAGRIST:

Oh, so some of the kids did too.

MORGADO:

Yes. Oh, yes.

SEAGRIST:

What do you know about their experiences in night school?

MORGADO:

Well, they learned how to read and write. More than ah, cause they went to work, soon after we got here. Well, not right away, anyway, you know. But so that they would be able to go to a school, work and get a job – they used to go to night school, plus the days – at that time they were able to leave school at 16 years of age. Then from there, they used to go to night school. My father saw to that.

SEAGRIST:

When you guys first got here, and of course, the older brothers and sisters are in their teens, right, at this point?

MORGADO:

Right. Mm, hm.

SEAGRIST:

Did any of them have to go right to work without going to school at all?

MORGADO:

No.

SEAGRIST:

So all of the kids got some schooling?

MORGADO:

Oh, yes. Definitely.

SEAGRIST:

What sibling got a job first?

MORGADO:

My oldest brother.

SEAGRIST:

And what job did he get?

MORGADO:

Gee, I don't know.

SEAGRIST:

Is that the brother that came with your dad?

MORGADO:

With my father, yes. Uh, huh.

SEAGRIST:

I see, What about of the kids, what about the other kids?

MORGADO:

Well, my sisters later on, when they start working, they went to work in a dress shop. They were sewing machine operators. That's what they did.

SEAGRIST:

What was the hardest thing for you to get adjusted to in this country?

MORGADO:

The cold weather. (laughing)

SEAGRIST:

Do you have a story? You know, you told earlier, the sweater story, but ah...

MORGADO:

Well, the thing was, my father, like one week, he bought me a coat. Another week, he bought my sister a coat. And then it was my brother Al, hadn't gotten a coat yet. And we went to school, it was so cold one day. So what I did, with my sister Catharine, we put him between the two of us, we opened our coats and we walked sideways to school so that he could be, you know, covered, with our coats to keep warm. That we did. So when we got home we told my father, that's when my father says, all right. I'll take him out tomorrow and buy him a coat.

SEAGRIST:

Do you remember seeing snow for the first time?

MORGADO:

Oh, yes. We loved it!

SEAGRIST:

Can you describe that for me?

MORGADO:

Oh, it was the cold, and you know, we went out and we were dancing in the snow and throwing it up in the air. (laughing)

SEAGRIST:

What do you think was the hardest thing for your mother to get adjusted to in this country?

MORGADO:

Well, over here she had to do all the work. Of course, we used to help her out, but in Brazil, she didn't have to do that. See, my father, what he earned was enough to get a maid. And sometimes there you get a maid just for their room and board too. And they're willing to work for you, of course you get their clothes, you buy everything they need.

SEAGRIST:

And the cost of living is much lower too, I should think.

MORGADO:

Oh, yes. Right. Yes.

SEAGRIST:

So she actually had to do work that she wasn't accustomed to doing.

MORGADO:

That's right, that's right, yes.

SEAGRIST:

Did she keep contact with her family in Brazil?

MORGADO:

Oh yes. All the time.

SEAGRIST:

Did any of them ever come to America to visit, or to live?

MORGADO:

Well, we had, not to live, but we had a cousin that used to be an airline stewardess and she used to come and visit us.

SEAGRIST:

Of course that would be later.

MORGADO:

Oh yes, later on. Right. (they laugh) Well, my grandmother died not too long after we came.

SEAGRIST:

I'm just curious, how did your mother react to her mother's death?

MORGADO:

Oh, she was very depressed. You know, felt very bad. We all did.

SEAGRIST:

I was wondering if she just suddenly felt like that was the last, her last connection to...

MORGADO:

Yeah, that's what I... She did feel that way. Yes. Although she kept writing to her bother. But you know, the correspondence after a while, you know, just faded away, as usual. And he died about two years after we were here.

SEAGRIST:

So she is sort of losing these other connections pretty quickly.

MORGADO:

Right. Uh, huh.

SEAGRIST:

When you think of yourself, do you think of yourself as Portuguese, or American, or what? How do you think of yourself in terms of nationality.

MORGADO:

Brazilian. Brazilian-American citizen. P: When did you become a citizen?

MORGADO:

Well, when my father got his citizenship papers, and we were not old enough to get our own, so we became citizens under his citizenship.

SEAGRIST:

Do you remember what year that was?

MORGADO:

Gee, I don't remember.

SEAGRIST:

Was it soon after you got here?

MORGADO:

Oh, yes. Not too far after we got here.

SEAGRIST:

Um, we have just a second left, and I want to make sure we mention Mr. Morgado. What year did you get married?

MORGADO:

Ah, May 31, 1936.

SEAGRIST:

And your husband's name?

MORGADO:

Joseph.

SEAGRIST:

Mor---

MORGADO:

Morgado.

SEAGRIST:

And where did he come from?

MORGADO:

Portugal.

SEAGRIST:

And what year did he come to America?

MORGADO:

1910, oh, wait a minute. 1919.

SEAGRIST:

1919, and Mr. Morgado told me he had come through Providence.

MR. MORGADO:

Providence, Rhode Island.

MORGADO:

Rhode Island.

SEAGRIST:

And what was it that you liked about him when you met him?

MORGADO:

Well, I didn't like him, to be very honest with you. Because I met him at one of the dances that my father's, you know.

SEAGRIST:

One of these socials.

MORGADO:

Socials, right. And he was always staring at me, every time I danced around. He was always staring. And I didn't like anybody staring at me. So I told this fellow I was dancing with. I said, you know, but let's not dance by that fellow. He says, why? Is he getting fresh with you. I'll take him out! I says, no. I just don't like him. (laughing)

SEAGRIST:

Did you have children?

MORGADO:

Two boys.

SEAGRIST:

Their names?

MORGADO:

Joseph Martin Morgado, Jr. And Richard Anthony Morgado.

SEAGRIST:

Great. We have to end, we've got like a second left. This is Paul Seagrist signing off with Helene Morgado on Sunday, September 24, 1995 in West Harrison, outside... END INTERVIEW